The damage for the rapier seems a little high: 1d6 seems more "realistic", unless you're going for something more like an estoc?

rhialto wrote:

The damage for the rapier seems a little high: 1d6 seems more "realistic", unless you're going for something more like an estoc?

I was thinking of that (I started with 3e where it's 1d6, I keep on being surprised when I don't see it in the OSR equipment lists to be honest, but then I look at the list in like, UA and realise they're not there either), but I based it off the rapier from the old free 2e Savage Coast book where they're 1d6+1 which, looking at the list of equipment, isn't really something that Hyperborea does so I figured it'd make more sense to go up one level (plus, assuming I did the math right, the average damage between 1d6+1 and 1d8 should be roughly the same?).

Edit: It makes some sense to me, they are precise strikes so I can believe that you're more likely to hit something good, though I could see that as being an argument for 1d6 and some kind of critical hit bonus.

Ghul wrote:

We do have a sickle sword, which is sufficiently a khopesh, IMO. Rapier would not be a bad addition. I've thought about it before. 

Hm, I have been slightly over-estimating the size of the khopesh as it turns out, though its description as a sword/battle-axe makes me think of it as a heavier weapon which is why I put it more in line with the long sword/battle axe. Plus I do like giving it a bonus to disarming attacks, but I just think that's a fun thing.

Last edited by Carnby (1/18/2022 4:55 pm)

rhialto wrote:

I think your other rule (about the rapier counting as just a WC1 weapon for two-weapon fighting penalties) balances out its 1d6 damage: easier to hit with, but still less than a long/broad sword in damage (aside: there is no mechanical difference between long and broad swords in Hyperborea).

Ah, that's reasonable, yeah.

Jimm.Iblis wrote:

As far as rapier, I don't have those but I do have estoc (tuck), 1d6 damage, WC 2, fights as long sword. Their "thing" is that they ignore 1 DR.

Nice idea, and models the estoc's armor-piercing design. 
 

BlackKnight wrote:

But even I have Limits... I don't think I'd be allowing any sets of Full Maximillian Plate armor from 15th century Germany... 

That said, a 15th century Imperial Knight going back to his family's robber baron roots now that he's free of Imperial oversight would make a fun enemy, with a great reward at the end.

I mentioned the shotel, I think it's a fun weapon that fits as a larger example of the falcata-type (I figure the larger Dacian falx would fall under this banner too). I'm thinking, essentially, that it's a bastard sword-type that trades the higher damage potential for more specialised uses, as it was effective in getting around shields and dismounting riders. Not sure about exact damage numbers, I've tentatively considered 1d6 (1d8 or 2d4) and considered mastery doing something, though I'm not sure what it'd do.

Shotel | WC 3 | 40gp | 5 lbs. | 1d8 (2d4)
-Ignores AC Bonus provided by opponent's shield (if any)
-Weapon has a 4-in-6 chance to dismount a rider on a natural 19 or 20 attack roll

As for where they come from, I assume falx-types are occasionally sported by Romans. If placing shotels specifically, with the culture that implies, I'd tentatively place them in the area between the Red Desert, the Lizard Coast, and the Black Forest. Less than a century ago (the second native-born generation is coming of age about now), a motley group of Ge'ez speaking, anti-Aksumite rebels arrived in Hyperborea while escaping a larger force. Without the Kingdom of Aksum to unite them, they have split into numerous small, bickering communities that largely survive on agriculture and mercenary work. Originally composed of Christian, Jewish, and Pagan elements, most have adopted the surrounding religions and have, since the founding of Larchmere Yys, quickly taken to the worship of Apollo, particularly in the northern territories. While currently still culturally distinct, these communities are quickly being absorbed into the surrounding cultures; while many still know Ge'ez, it is no longer the primary language in most communities, with Common being most common in the north and a somewhat divergent form of Goidelic Keltic (written in Ge'ez script, one of its few holdouts) in the south. It is likely that within a couple more generations they will have been completely absorbed into the surrounding cultures. A few of the oldest generation, those who first came to Hyperborea, still live and hold to their old beliefs, though most of them have retired into religious hermitage, often in the Red Desert.

Just something small that can fit in without radically upsetting the area, though placement is, as I mentioned, tentative. I think the tradition of Desert Fathers is a fun one, which is why I tried to place them next to a desert, and if you've ever read the El Borak story "Blood of the Gods", I think you could make a real fun sword and sorcery adventure from that religious hermitage.

And here are the original weapons with some revisions (shortening the khopesh and dropping the rapier damage to 1d6 as discussed)

Khopesh | WC 1 | 30gp | 4 lbs. | 1d8 (1d10)
-Disarm attacks made with a khopesh are made at -2 (as a flail)

Rapier | WC 2 | 40gp | 4 lbs. | 1d6
-A rapier master fighting with a rapier in one hand and a WC 1 weapon in the other treats the rapier as a WC 1 weapon for the purposes of "to hit" penalties.

Ghul wrote:

As an aside, I seem to recall that in AD&D 2E, for the rapier you used your dex "to hit" modifier instead of str. I could be wrong, I'd have to check it out.

I think that was when they started with "Weapon Finesse" and such. but may have started in 2nd/3rd Ed...
 

The khopesh is in Unearthed Arcana, doing 2d4 (vs small/medium), which seems sensible given its axe-like qualities. I’d also suggest using this for swords such as the Canaanite style sickle sword given similarities with the Khopesh (I assume they are related weapons).  For the smaller agricultural-type sickle, 1d4 seems sensible.