HYPERBOREA / Spells that allow for defence adjustment (DX)

**Posted by Ghul** 12/10/2015 3:18 pm

In AS&SH, defence adjustment (DX) can help (or hinder) sorcery saving throws of certain spells. A few examples are provided in the decription of dexterity:

Defence Adjustment: Agility and elusiveness can modify armour class (AC): Low dexterity can raise (worsen) AC, whilst high dexterity can lower (improve) AC (see OTHER STATISTICS, armour class). This modifier also applies to all avoidance saving throws (e.g., breath weapons, ray guns, some traps) and any spell or spell effect saving throw that involves dodging (e.g., entangle, fireball, lightning bolt).

The same rule is also mentioned in the SAVING THROW section of the rules:

Dexterity can modify avoidance saving throws and saving throws versus spells and effects that involve dodging (cone of cold, entangle, fireball, lightning bolt, etc.).

Rather than leaving the referee guessing which spells may or may not qualify, I have compiled a list of all the spells that I feel best suit this rule. I plan to include this clarification in the hardback edition of the rules, but I'm opening the topic to discussion here, because I'm wondering if anyone thinks I've missed a spell that should be included, or if I've included a spell that should not be included. Here is my list:

Black tentacles, chain lightning, colour spray, cone of cold, controlled blast fireball, enervation, entangle, exploding skull, fire seeds (berries), fire trap, fireball, flame strike, flaming sphere, forest of bones, frost sphere, glyph of warding (blast effect), lightning bolt, shock wave, shout, shove.

The intent is to include a brief note in each of these spell descriptions that tells players and referees that the defence adjustment (DX) applies.

Cheers,
Jeff T.

**Posted by Handy Haversack** 12/10/2015 5:47 pm

You can provide the list--my players will still ask me "what applies?"

I can't think of anything offhand to add, except to mention similar effects from devices.

**Posted by DMPrata** 12/11/2015 10:22 am

Oddly—I know!—on this issue I'd prefer to leave it to the referee to adjudicate. Let the player ask, "Hey, can I add my DX modifier to this save?" When in doubt, the referee can ask the player to describe how his character might dodge the attack form and rule accordingly.

**Posted by mabon5127** 12/11/2015 11:18 am

DMPrata wrote:
Oddly—I know!—on this issue I'd prefer to leave it to the referee to adjudicate. Let the player ask, "Hey, can I add my DX modifier to this save?" When in doubt, the referee can ask the player to describe how his character might dodge the attack form and rule accordingly.

I also would rather make the decision based on the situation and the spell used than have a list. Its a separate look up and I probably would just award based on my judgement.

Things I Worked On · **Posted by Ynas Midgard** 12/11/2015 12:38 pm

I'm not sure if it's a necessary addition (although I'm actually leaning towards the inclusion for clarity's sake), but I definitely don't think it's additional work remembering this detail; players can already note whether their spell allows the opposition a saving throw, so they can put this information down as well. As for referees, I do the same thing: when compiling the list of spells for NPCs I'm putting key variables in parentheses.

**Posted by Ghul** 12/11/2015 6:24 pm

It's definitely not necessary. But the list is so small (20 spells), that I thought, why not just mention them by name? Of course, any referee worth his or her salt is simply going to decide on these matters case-by-case.

**Posted by DMPrata** 12/12/2015 9:59 am

I think there are so many other situations that can be dodged that a finite list of spells will still be incomplete. I can dodge that wand or ray gun and so add my DX mod to my device save, right? What about a death (poison) save versus a spitting snake? I can't think of a good transformation example, but you get the point.