HYPERBOREA / What makes it a Third Edition?

**Posted by Spider of Leng** 5/11/2021 1:10 pm

Since we've got Jeff's ear here, any chance of a two page character record sheet? I really don't like the 4 page ones.

**Posted by Ghul** 5/11/2021 2:56 pm

Spider of Leng wrote:
Since we've got Jeff's ear here, any chance of a two page character record sheet? I really don't like the 4 page ones.

Actually, it's funny that you mention it, because I've been working on this very concept -- a two-page standard sheet, and a two-page addendum sheet for spell casters. So, it's quite possible that this is how the 3e sheets are presented, but the old sheets will be 100% compatible, too.

**Posted by Spider of Leng** 5/11/2021 7:49 pm

Ghul wrote:
Spider of Leng wrote:
Since we've got Jeff's ear here, any chance of a two page character record sheet? I really don't like the 4 page ones.
Actually, it's funny that you mention it, because I've been working on this very concept -- a two-page standard sheet, and a two-page addendum sheet for spell casters. So, it's quite possible that this is how the 3e sheets are presented, but the old sheets will be 100% compatible, too.

Sweet! I could live with that.

**Posted by rhialto** **Online!** 5/12/2021 6:28 am

Seconded for a 3e revised character sheet: I also find the 4-page sheet too much, and have toyed on-and-off with my own. While I love the aesthetic of the current official sheet, a simple two-sided sheet is more my preference. But with style!

**Posted by fireinthedust** 5/12/2021 10:58 am

Ghul wrote:
fireinthedust wrote:
My two cents:
A cantrip that can make someone sneeze and stuff like that. They could be used creatively and made useful, but it's not something I plan to entertain in the near future.
The pyromancer idea isn't bad, but I am always reluctant to head down the road of D&D 5E in which a plethora of "constant" cool powers evoked at will have stripped the game of an integral and crucial (IMO) element: resource management. Hyperborea is a cold, unforgiving world, and the idea of a class being able to warm up any situation without any appropriate cost is not something that I would want in games I run for my players. I want my players to struggle, because they deserve to suffer.

Oh, for sure about the 5e. I don't like the random powers all over of 5e. I'm running a game, and I keep forgetting I'm not playing my usual OSR games, like AS&SH or DCC, which are more the survival horror. 5e isn't, and it seems odd when players can do things that are meant to be more tabletop-minis-wargame, when I've got them foraging for food.

I suppose my preferred change would be "give my firelord warlock a free lighter". Like, he can just light a spark as needed. Maybe pay 1hp to spark a flame?

**Posted by Ghul** 5/12/2021 12:07 pm

fireinthedust wrote:
Ghul wrote:
fireinthedust wrote:
My two cents:
A cantrip that can make someone sneeze and stuff like that. They could be used creatively and made useful, but it's not something I plan to entertain in the near future.
The pyromancer idea isn't bad, but I am always reluctant to head down the road of D&D 5E in which a plethora of "constant" cool powers evoked at will have stripped the game of an integral and crucial (IMO) element: resource management. Hyperborea is a cold, unforgiving world, and the idea of a class being able to warm up any situation without any appropriate cost is not something that I would want in games I run for my players. I want my players to struggle, because they deserve to suffer.

Oh, for sure about the 5e. I don't like the random powers all over of 5e. I'm running a game, and I keep forgetting I'm not playing my usual OSR games, like AS&SH or DCC, which are more the survival horror. 5e isn't, and it seems odd when players can do things that are meant to be more tabletop-minis-wargame, when I've got them foraging for food.

I suppose my preferred change would be "give my firelord warlock a free lighter". Like, he can just light a spark as needed. Maybe pay 1hp to spark a flame?

Fair enough! Try it out as a house rule and let us know how it goes!

**Posted by tomas** 5/12/2021 1:45 pm

Rereading the changes mentioned in the first post, I'm also happy to see that you'll be doing an atlas style change with the map. I assume it will be in the actual book itself? Can you say what makes the new poster map special version?

**Posted by Blackadder23** 5/12/2021 1:53 pm

I definitely agree with the change to two hardcover books. The 2e hardcover is glorious, but it's just a hair short of being too large for practical use. Two separate books will be much handier.

**Posted by Ghul** 5/12/2021 2:11 pm

tomas wrote:
Rereading the changes mentioned in the first post, I'm also happy to see that you'll be doing an atlas style change with the map. I assume it will be in the actual book itself? Can you say what makes the new poster map special version?

Yes, I'm gathering quotes on a coil-bound atlas for superior referee utility at the game table.

We might do another canvas map as the "special" but I'm looking into other possibilities, too.

**Posted by Ghul** 5/12/2021 2:11 pm

Blackadder23 wrote:
I definitely agree with the change to two hardcover books. The 2e hardcover is glorious, but it's just a hair short of being too large for practical use. Two separate books will be much handier.

I concur.

**Posted by gizmomathboy** 5/12/2021 3:39 pm

Oooohhh, an atlas.That sounds wonderful

**Posted by Iron Ranger** 5/12/2021 8:04 pm

Will there be previous editions quick primer chart/page for those of us still using our original box sets?
Similar to the Cook/Marsh expert set intro business for those who clung tightly to their Holmes during Moldvay?

**Posted by rhialto** **Online!** 5/13/2021 5:10 am

fireinthedust wrote:
[I suppose my preferred change would be "give my firelord warlock a free lighter". Like, he can just light a spark as needed. Maybe pay 1hp to spark a flame?

Beyond the Wall and Through Sunken Lands both introduce Cantrips and Rituals (while preserving Old School Vancian Spells): the former matches your desire above (slight magical effect), and the latter is more powerful (but taking an hour/level to cast). Both are rolled for success, however, with failure causing the loss of all magical ability or an unwanted side-effect (caster choice) and the latter always working, but with an unwanted side-effect on failure. It's an interesting adjunct to standard OSR spells.

**Posted by Spider of Leng** 5/13/2021 7:52 am

Castles & Crusades has 0 level spells, which are a mix of cantrips and common, non-combat spells like light, dancing lights, ghost sounds, etc. Wizards, for example get 4 of these at 1st level and a few more later on, in addition to their other spells. A 1st level wizard in C&C gets 2 level 1 spells in addition, plus INT bonus. It's still Vancian, but gives lower level casters in particular at lot more to work with.

**Posted by deathknight4044** 5/13/2021 8:45 am

Will the timeline of hyperboreas history be re written (stuff like the ashen worm and green death) to account for the new races, or do you plan on keeping it as written and the new races be more recent arrivals to the setting?

**Posted by Ghul** 5/13/2021 9:39 am

deathknight4044 wrote:
Will the timeline of hyperboreas history be re written (stuff like the ashen worm and green death) to account for the new races, or do you plan on keeping it as written and the new races be more recent arrivals to the setting?

With the exception of the Carolingian Franks, every "new" race mentioned has already been a part of the setting if you dig around through the gazetteer, so no retcon of anything is necessary. It's more a matter of all these races mentioned before not being presented as playable options, and now they are.

Last edited by Ghul (5/13/2021 6:40 pm)

**Posted by Big Shiny** 5/13/2021 1:17 pm

The outline of the new races is exactly what I am looking forward to.

**Posted by Ghul** 5/13/2021 6:40 pm

Big Shiny wrote:
The outline of the new races is exactly what I am looking forward to.

Glad to hear it!

**Posted by rhialto** **Online!** 5/13/2021 6:56 pm

Ghul wrote:
With the exception of the Carolingian Franks, every "new" race mentioned has already been a part of the setting if you dig around through the gazetteer, so no retcon of anything is necessary. It's more a matter of all these races mentioned before not being presented as playable options, and now they are.

Excellent, glad to hear this. Though, should there be only 12 Paladins if the Carolingian Franks are "new"?

**Posted by Ghul** 5/14/2021 9:41 am

rhialto wrote:
Ghul wrote:
With the exception of the Carolingian Franks, every "new" race mentioned has already been a part of the setting if you dig around through the gazetteer, so no retcon of anything is necessary. It's more a matter of all these races mentioned before not being presented as playable options, and now they are.

Excellent, glad to hear this. Though, should there be only 12 Paladins if the Carolingian Franks are "new"?

Indeed. And they shall build a hexagonal table...